Big Lead Sports Bar



With all the happenings of the last few weeks, the weekly polls have gotten a little lost in the shuffle. But fear not, they are making their triumphant return as I clear up a backlog of questions that I'm anxious to hear your opinions on. After the much-maligned "jump", of course.

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Jim said...

I'm baffled by the outrage about the Steelers right now. You don't know these guys. They're not your friends. Do I want my favorite football players to get in trouble with the law? Of course not. But Santonio wasn't charged with a crime. Ben Roethlisberger hasn't been charged either and the other case appears to be a frivolous lawsuit. Unless you're Roger Goodell, you're innocent until proven guilty. Anybody who's talking about cutting Santonio Holmes or drafting a QB is out of their mind. If Ben actually does get charged and is found guilty, then I'll change my mind. If it does happen, it's not the end of the world because Ben Roethlisberger doesn't really effect my life whatsoever. He probably feels the same way about you, so why care?

Jim said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Jim said...

PS - Watch the movie Cocaine Cowboys. Your 70's Super Steelers weren't exactly perfect citizens either. One of the biggest cocaine dealers in Miami tells an anecdote about the whole Steelers o-line blowing lines of cocaine the entire week before the Super Bowl. They also took steroids, but I'll give them the benefit of the doubt on that since it wasn't illegal back then.

Louis Lipps is my homeboy said...

I saw Cocaine Cowboys.

Maybe I'm warped, but the part where the drug dealer said he had the entire Steelers offensive line on his couch doing blow the week of the Super Bowl and he was like "Don't you guys have a big game to practice for?" and they were just like "Pssshhh, whatever, we're gonna win anyways." was kind of awesome!

The 70s Steelers were so good that they could hang out til all hours of the night doing drugs and STILL kick your ass on Sunday haha.

Steve said...

Jim - It's not outrage, just disappointment. Only Corey is outraged. Sure, I would consider trading Holmes if the trade was beneficial. Who wants a player on the team that at any moment could be arrested for simple stupidity if nothing else and based on his latest tweets, there's a good chance of that happening at any moment. He's already one stike away from a league suspension if he farts the wrong note, so how's that good for the team? With the emergence of Wallace and the signing of Randel El, maybe the Rooneys are thinking the same thing.

I am surprised however at the number of people who think the Pirates are on the right track. Adam must have been voting yes like a madman.

BurressWithButterflywings said...


Right on. It's more disappointment with me, as well. And Tone is a walking liability.

Whatever happened to speak softly and carry a big stick? We all know Tone has the second part covered.......

Chip said...

Steve, I think it's because unlike you evidently, most people in Pittsburgh have a sense of morality to where rape and hulking football players assaulting women offends them.

Do I expect the players to be choir boys? Of course not. But smoking a joint or smacking a towel dispenser around doesn't hurt anybody. It's stupid but it's not the worst crime in the world.

However, when your moronic QB is tagged with sexually violating women TWICE in less than a year and your WR has a history of physically abusing women, that is a little too much for most half-way decent people to handle. And considering the Steelers are supposed to "Do things the right way," it only makes it that much worse.

Koz said...

As much as I've come to loathe the Pirates for what they have put us through, I guess it's fair to say they are "on the right track". They aren't wasting big money on over the hill FA's, they've actually tried to develop scouting and draft better players instead of cheaper ones. Maybe they are on the right track, but I think they're still thousands of miles away from the next station.

Steve said...

Scrath that - I meant Chip.

So moral Chip, you're convinced that Ben has raped and assulted without a trial or conviction to prove it? Maybe you should bring some of the evidence you obviously have to the lawyers for these women and we can have this all wrapped up in a couple days and get on with whether or not we need a new QB.

Wow, the country could have used your level-headed prudence and rational thinking when they were burning and drowning witches long ago...could have killed at lot more innocent people.

jmarinara said...

Question 3 - None of the above. I will follow them, but I'm not convinced at all they're on the right track.

Question 9 - The price of attending an NFL game, and the availability of tickets, is at the point of preventing me from going. I've lived in Pittsburgh most of my life and have never been to a Steeler game.

okel dokel said...

Once again, Mr. Wake and Bake is going nowhere. He is a UFA after this season and given the uncertainty of the labor situation no team will be interested in trading for him.

The Steelers will not cut him and get nothing in return. I am sure they are not comfortable with his antics but they, unlike some of the public, always seem willing to wait and see what happens with the legal proceedings. They certainly did it for Ernie Holmes and Joe Gilliam.

Chip, you are a sanctimonious piece of crap. Nice high horse you are riding on, I am sure many people want to knock you off of it.

Koz said...

As per my previous comments, while the Pirates might be on the right track, or at least a better track... I still couldn't care less about them.

They are dead to me.

Chip said...

So being disgusted by men who beat and rape women is "sanctimonious?"

Okay... Nice to know. I'm sure glad to know that some of you guys are A-OK with rape and sexual assault. Thank god the vast majority of Steeler fans are not as completely morally bankrupt as you guys.

By the way, how many of you posted here saying how strongly you objected to the Steelers signing Michael Vick? Or Terrell Owens? Or Larry Johnson?

Oh, I get it, it's only okay to have standards when it's not your moronic white QB who's a filthy degenerate.

Louis Lipps is my homeboy said...

The Pirates thing needed other choices.

Like "I don't feel they're totally on the right track, but I'll probably pay attention to them anyways.

okel dokel said...

Chip, your "outrage" is not why I call you sanctimonious. You have already labeled both as guilty, hence the moniker I gifted you with.

I do not condone any activities that involve violence in any way, shape, or form. However, until they are guilty in a court of law and not by TMZ, PFT or morons on talk radio, chat rooms and comments sections I will withhold my outrage. Both act like entitled idiots because they are rich, young football players and for that I do not hold them in very high esteem.

You are what is wrong with this country. You would rather believe what is rumor and hearsay than allow due process.

Go watch a reality show and STFU.

Dr. Kelly Stone said...

2. Still a fan of Ben the QB, not necessarily Ben the PH.
3. I do the same thing every Pirate season, hope for 83 wins, have hopes squashed by July.
4. Not until Tone starts dropping (foot)balls.
5. The Pens should watch "Rocky III".
7. I would not have expected to see that question ever on a Pittsburgh sports blog...shameful!!
8. Willie is going to have to go pretty cheap.
9. There is always some form of belligerence in a crowd of 60k, if you are looking for a less bawdy crowd, try the ballet.

Anonymous said...

Chip -

Michael Vick - tried in court GUILTY of his charges

Terrell OWens - No crimes, just locker room cancer

Larry Johnson - 4 arrests and and plead guilty in 2 cases.

Ben - 0 arrests, 2 accusations, 0 charges.

Completely different circumstances between those 3 and Ben. Good thing people like you were around for the Duke lacrosse case.

Jester said...

Hey Okel Dokel,

OJ was found not guilty, too.

Just sayin'

okel dokel said...

Hey Jeremy,

No shit Sherlock! Let me see if your pea brain can understand the following.

Have either Ben or Santonio had their trials yet? The answer is no. Hence, I will not condemn either person until they have their day in court.

At that time if they are found innocent and the facts surrounding the case, which prove to be true, say other wise, I will probably condemn them at that time, just like I did O.J.

Hey did either Ben or Santanio run from the police in a white Ford Bronco? Just sayin'

Well I guess it would have been an Escalade rather than a Bronco.

BurressWithButterflywings said...

What was a bigger achievement for OJ, rushing for 2000 yds in one season, or slashing 2 throats in one night?

Greatest. Interview. Ever.

okel dokel said...

His greatest achievement was either running through airports, his acting in The Naked Gun, or getting his comeuppance and finally serving time for basically being a pompous jerk.

Anonymous said...

Investigation into Holmes' incident has been "reactivated" as the accuser is now willing to cooperate with police.

Louis Lipps is my homeboy said...


It's not like you were unbiased about Big Ben, THEN turned against him when the charges came up.

You didn't like the guy from the start, so you basically used the charges to act like a colossal dick and yell "I told you so!" about Ben to all the other commenters here.

That's obnoxious, and it's what's rubbed some people the wrong way about you.

Jester said...

Wow Okel Dokel...turning to verbal threats on a comments section of a blog. Is your wee-wee bigger now?

Anyway, it's not like this is Ben's first accusation. The two accusations (and crashing a bike WO a helmet) show that he is not the brightest bulb. I'll go by his actions and make my own opinions.

As for the thug from tOSU, here are his credits:
(1) Former Dope Slinger;
(2) Accused of Disorderly Conduct;
(3) Accused beater of ONE of his Baby Mamas;
(4) Arrested and cited for having weed;
(5) Accused beater of woman in Miami AGAIN.

So, you may wait for the courts, I'll just go by his actions.


BurressWithButterflywings said...

I had no idea we had so many lawyers and civil liberties crusaders on this site, beating the "innocent until proven guilty" drum rather loud.

A lot of posters are quick to discredit by citing Chip has no specific evidence to prove either of the players' guilt and you aren't wrong, he hasn't generated anything other than personal opinion. However, I haven't seen any of Chip's detractors produce a concrete piece of evidence to prove anybodys innocence, either.

In these he said/ she said cases, it's anybody's guess. Tone has been in trouble before, and not for peeing in public or smashing a towel dispenser, so that is a bad start. It's getting harded and harder to give Ben the benefit of the doubt, as well. Still, we don't have enough information to make a determination either way.

I think some people here are so obsessed with defending their local sports heroes,that they lose sight of the bigger picture involved with these allegations.

You have bashed Ben and Tone's accusers without hesitation, but you admonish Chip for not presonally knowing the players in question at the same time?

Let's all take of the black and gold glasses for a second and wait for something substantial to come out. I am certainly as guilty as anybody here of jumping to conclusions about these 2 cases, but that is because I used to take pride in the "Steelers Way" and didn't want to see the franchise image tarnished. How naive, right?

And believe me, the LAST thing I want to see is Dennis Dixon starting the entire season........

okel dokel said...


My johnson is big enough thank you. Thank god you are not involved in any decision made by either the Steelers or the Penguins. Since you are so quick to throw around your morality with regard to sports teams who are you going to cheer for when the Steelers continue to disappoint you? Every team is infected with some sort of "thuggish" element.

This bullshit over the "Steelers Way" is the cause of too many people wearing Black and Gold glasses and not realizing some of the people this team has employed in their history. The Steelers were very good about "keeping things in house." Not possible in these days and times and that is probably a good thing. Also, people are projecting their own sense of morality on the Steelers as well.

I have never said I did not think either Holmes or Rothlisbeger aren't idiots, scumbags or trolls. It seems like they are, hey so are a great number of Pittsburgh sports stars past and present. The bottom line is they are entitled to due process just like the alledged victims. Now, what if it turns out all incidents were "get rich" quick schemes by the accusers; what are you going to say then? Do you know these people's history?

Thankfully I do not run the Steelers but if I did here is what I would be doing now;

1. Planning for life without Santonio Holmes in 2011. Start sending him the message by reducing his playing time and making him the 4 or 5th option more frequently than not.

2. Let Ben know he is no longer in charge. Stop consulting him about coaching staff changes and start bringing in honest competition for his job at every opportunity and get rid of him when appropriate.

3. Never would have franchised Skippy.

Nate said...

"So being disgusted by men who beat and rape women is "sanctimonious?""

No, but assuming guilt before a trail or any evidence available to the public to support your position is.

"Okay... Nice to know. I'm sure glad to know that some of you guys are A-OK with rape and sexual assault. Thank god the vast majority of Steeler fans are not as completely morally bankrupt as you guys."

Nobody has said this. Nice straw man you set up there.

"By the way, how many of you posted here saying how strongly you objected to the Steelers signing Michael Vick? Or Terrell Owens? Or Larry Johnson?"

Michael Vick was convicted and confessed to his crimes. Even then, I didn't object to signing him based on that. I objected to signing him because I just never thought he was that good.

Terrell Owens is a known dick. There's a reason a receiver as talented as him has played for as many teams as he has.

Larry Johnson is a known dick, a *convicted* criminal as opposed to having been occused and an over the hill RB who hasn't done anything noteworthy on the field since 2006.

"Oh, I get it, it's only okay to have standards when it's not your moronic white QB who's a filthy degenerate."

Way to play the race card. Bonus points for the credibility of your argument.

"However, I haven't seen any of Chip's detractors produce a concrete piece of evidence to prove anybodys innocence, either. "

You don't have to prove innocence. Innocence is assumed until evidence leads one to believe otherwise. That's why it's called "innocent until proven guilty."

Also, have you ever heard the phrase "you can't prove a negative?" We can't prove that Ben DIDN'T sexually assault that girl. No matter what comes out in this case, only Ben and that girl will know for sure what happened. You also can't prove that leprechauns and unicorns don't exist, but I'd say that given the evidence we have it's a safe bet to say that they don't.

Unknown said...


get a grip dude. I'm pretty sure no Steeler fan condones rape or assault on a woman--- but as was repeatedly pointed out already--- you are unfairly convinced that Ben is guilty before he is even charged! From what little we know about the case so far, her accusations seem pretty shaky.

It's bad enough that Ben is getting crucified by other fans, but to hear it coming from so-called Steelers fans is dis-heartening. Give him the benefit of the doubt at least. Let's wait and see how it turns out.

Seriously, though, did he snub you for an autograph? I can only assume that is where all this hatred of Ben is stemming from. Or did you just not read any facts about either allegation yet? Neither sound legitimate.

Go Steelers!

Unknown said...

I voted YES to the last question not because of people being intoxicated and using vulgar language, but because of the negativity of fans. Any game I have gone to (and I go to at least two every season), I hear booing from the home town Steeler fans all too often. It ticks me off. We have the best team in the league and they have provided us exciting and entertaining football for YEARS, yet some jerk has to yell for Batch to replace Ben everytime he throws an incomplete pass! Or Harrison gets ridiculed because he doesn't get a sack in EVERY game. It frustrates me that some of our fans can be so obtuse. I'm sure its the same in other stadiums, but WE should be held to a higher standard. We have the Steelers. We should be grateful. Boo if you want-- I know it's your right-- but think about how fortunate we've been and maybe try to show some respect.